Is Quantum Of Solace the worst ever James Bond film?

[James]

Well, Daniel Craig is supposed to be a serious actor. He retrospectively slagged off Tomb Raider as if the whole experience & film was beneath him and had a good laugh about that so I wonder how he really feels about QoS. I'm sure he doesn't need anyone to point out to him that it was a right load of old cobblers and savaged by a suprisingly high number of critics. He must be wondering what pile of old rubbish Eon have lined up next.

[Mazer Rackham]

Well, Daniel Craig is supposed to be a serious actor. He retrospectively slagged off Tomb Raider as if the whole experience & film was beneath him and had a good laugh about that so I wonder how he really feels about QoS. I'm sure he doesn't need anyone to point out to him that it was a right load of old cobblers and savaged by a suprisingly high number of critics. He must be wondering what pile of old rubbish Eon have lined up next.

That's part of the question he has to answer. If he slags off now he'll be a hero. If he comes back and it is a bad or worse he'll definably be the man who ruined Bond.
He has a good exit now and can tell everyone he did what he wanted to do and didn't see anything to challenge him him Bond 23.

[Kristatos]

Well, Daniel Craig is supposed to be a serious actor. He retrospectively slagged off Tomb Raider as if the whole experience & film was beneath him and had a good laugh about that so I wonder how he really feels about QoS.

He always gave me the impression that he considered Bond beneath him, even before CR came out. EON seem to have a policy at the moment of only hiring people who hate Bond films and luring them in with the promise that they can destroy as much of the Bond tradition as they like. Haggis, Craig, Forster, the uncredited guy who got the script polish job on QOS based on an "anti-Bond film" that he'd written and so on. Purvis & Wade seem to be the only people left there who have any love of, or feel for, Bond. I'm surprised they haven't been fed to the sharks (with fricking laser beams on their head) yet.

[James]

It'll be interesting to see if Craig makes any candid comments about Bond years from now when he's well out of it. It's possible that his close relationship with Babs will mean he'll keep his gob shut but you never know.

[FelixLeiterRocks]

I'm new here, and I don't want to start a flame war, but QOS while not perfect is no where near the worst Bond movie. DAD or AVTAK would have to be my top two candidates. Most of the Brosnan movies other than GE were poor.

I can't believe anyone wouldn't like CR, it's one of the top 5 Bond films IMO. GE and CR had the same director, so it's no wonder CR was such a fine film.

QOS had some problems and wasn't as good as CR (which got a 94% rating on RottenTomatoes). But even QOS' 65% rating on RT is better than all the Brosnan movies except GE.

DAD was by far the most rediculous Bond film ever. It starts out pretty good, but after Bond is released from capture the film becomes silly.

While there are elements I miss from CR and QOS, the reinvention of Bond was needed. I don't view these films as a reboot, this is just Bond at the beginning of his career. Bond has always been a timeless character, I just view the Connery/Lazenby/Moore/Dalton/Brosnan films to take place after CR and QOS.

I will take the abscense of Q and Moneypenny for the return of Felix Leiter, a character not seen since the Dalton films. They can bring back Q and Moneypenny later, but it should be in a way that makes sense. John Cleese's Q was a complete joke, and I'm glad he was not asked back. He's a funny guy, but he's no Q.

[katied]

No flame war here. QOS is NOT perfect.Not by a long shot.And totally agreed about AVTAK and DAD and Leiter(I really like Wright's portrayal of him )

Great username BTW and welcome

[FelixLeiterRocks]

Thank you and agreed about Wright. He and David Hedison are my two favorite Leiters.

[Mazer Rackham]

QOS had some problems and wasn't as good as CR (which got a 94% rating on RottenTomatoes). But even QOS' 65% rating on RT is better than all the Brosnan movies except GE.

Hey there Felix.
Erroneous correlations about RT and Brozza, also plain wrong. TWINE is higher rated than Quark and might be the oldest of Brozza movies on RT that might qualify for comparison (*edit* I was wrong, the community rank is what came up first. However that make no difference to my main point). But most of the reviews counted are not contemporary (and not all of the contemporary reviews were counted) and there was no RT at the time or GE and TND and it was still in its infancy at the start of TWINE, DAD would actually be the best example because the internet age was actually going on and the majority of all reviews were appearing online.

Glad you a fan of Felix Leiter, I'm sorry you haven't actually witnessed the Bond Felix friendship on screen yet. Certainly not with the curmudgeonly way it's been adapted recently.

[FelixLeiterRocks]

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/world_is_not_enough/

only 51% for TWINE vs 65% for QOS.

RT does a archive of old reviews for film and it's quite extensive. They also try to make adjustments for older films not having as many reviews.

TWINE is a perfect example of how rediculous Bond was becoming. I was quite upset at most of the Brosnan films (except for GE), after Dalton made a valliant effort at bringing a more serious nature to the character, Brosnan went right back to the corny Moore interpretation.

Denise Richards as a nuclear engineer?
Riding through an oil pipeline with no oxygen mask or protective suit?
Walking through an area where a plutonium device just exploded?

This was the rediculous nature that was TWINE. Oh and Christmas coming more than twice a year <groan>.

[Roger Devereau]

It's my least favourite Bond. If the criteria were to include production values, script and acting, then it would still be the worst Bond.

Just kidding.

I've read reviews from fans who hate Quantum of Solace, but have it high up on their list because of its tone and, presumably, for making the effort to try something different. I prefer some of the ropier Bond efforts to Quantum of Solace.

[Mazer Rackham]

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/world_is_not_enough/

only 51% for TWINE vs 65% for QOS.

RT does a archive of old reviews for film and it's quite extensive. They also try to make adjustments for older films not having as many reviews.

I already fixed my post before you posted.
RT does not have an extensive library of old reviews. At least not to my standards or a municipal libraries.
Some reviews disappear after awhile. Also some of the reviews are 2 to 3 years well after the fact. The earliest TWINE review was post to RT 1-1-00. The film came out in Nov 1999.

Over 11 of the rotten reviews are after 2002. This is in no way indicative of the over all publics (or critics) view of TWINE at the time. Unless we are to believe that less than a 100 reviews of TWINE were written in 1999-00.

The World Is Not Enough BY ROGER EBERT / November 19, 1999

"The World Is Not Enough" is a splendid comic thriller, exciting and graceful, endlessly inventive. Because it is also the 19th James Bond movie, it comes with so much history that one reviews it like wine, comparing it to earlier famous vintages; I guess that's part of the fun. This is a good one.

Instead of summarizing the plot, let's tick off the Bond trademarks and see how they measure up: 1. Bond himself. Pierce Brosnan. The best except for Sean Connery. He knows that even the most outrageous double entendres are pronounced with a straight face. He is proud that a generation has grown up knowing the term "double entendre" only because of Bond movies.

2. Regulars. There's real poignancy this time, because Q, the inventor of all of Bond's gizmos, is retiring. Desmond Llewelyn has played the character in every single Bond film since "From Russia With Love" in 1963 (with the exception of "Live and Let Die" in 1973, when the producers dropped Q after an insane decision that the series needed less gimmicks). Llewelyn is now 85, and after demonstrating a few nice touches on his latest inventions, he sinks from sight in an appropriate and, darn it, touching way.

3. Guest stars. Who could replace Q? John Cleese, of course. "Does this make you . . . R?" asks Bond, after Cleese demonstrates a BMW speedster with titanium armor "and six cup holders." 4. M. Judi Dench is back for the third time as Bond's boss M, with the same regal self-confidence she displayed as queens Elizabeth ("Shakespeare in Love") and Victoria ("Mrs. Brown"). She does not condescend to the role, but plays it fiercely, creating an intelligence chief who actually seems focused and serious, even in the uproar of a Bond plot.

5. Sex bombs. Usually two major ones, a good girl who seems bad, and a bad girl who seems good. Both first-rate this time. Sophie Marceau plays Elektra King, daughter of a tycoon behind an oil pipeline linking the old Soviet oil fields to Europe. Denise Richards plays Christmas Jones, a nuclear scientist whose knowledge can save or doom the world. I will not reveal who is bad-good or good-bad.

6. Chase sequences. Lots of them. By powerboat on the Thames (and across dry land, and back on the Thames) and then into a hot-air balloon. By skis down a mountain, pursued by hang-gliding, bomb-throwing para-sailers whose devices convert into snowmobiles. By land, in the BMW. Under the sea, as Bond breaks into a submarine and later pursues a villain by popping outside the sub and then in again.

7. Megalomaniacal villains. There is a terrific early appearance of the arch-terrorist Renard (Robert Carlyle). His oversized skull rises from the floor in a hologram, and then takes on flesh. M explains that a bullet in his brain is gradually robbing him of his senses, but that "he'll grow stronger every day until he dies." Bond walks around the hologram and reaches inside Renard's head to trace the path of the bullet. Another villain is played by Robbie Coltrane, who gets mileage out of always seeming like he'd really prefer to be a nice guy.

8. Locations. Not simply the oil field of Azerbaijan, but Frank Gehry's new Guggenheim Museum in Bilbao, Spain, which figures in a nifty opening sequence, and the Millennium Dome on the banks of the Thames, which becomes a landing pad after a balloon explodes. Also a Hindu holy place with flames that never die.

9. Weird ways to die. How about vivisection by helicopter-borne rotary tree-trimming blades? Or garroting in an antique torture chair? 10. Sensational escapes. There is nothing like a Bond picture to make you believe a man can safely bungee-jump from a tall building, after tying one end of a window shade cord to his belt and the other end to an unconscious body.

All of these elements are assembled by director Michael Apted and writers Neal Purvis, Robert Wade and Bruce Feirstein into a Bond picture that for once doesn't seem like set pieces uneasily glued together, but proceeds in a more or less logical way to explain what the problem and solution might be. Bond's one-liners seem more part of his character this time, and Carlyle's villain emerges as more three-dimensional and motivated, less of a caricature, than the evildoers in some of the Bond films.

My favorite moment? A small one, almost a throwaway. The movie answers one question I've had for a long time: How do the bad guys always manage to find all their equipment spontaneously, on remote locations where they could not have planned ahead? After the snow chase sequence, a villain complains morosely that the para-sails were rented, and "were supposed to be returned."

[katied]

I hate the "Christmas only comes once a year" line.Tacky.

[FelixLeiterRocks]

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/world_is_not_enough/

only 51% for TWINE vs 65% for QOS.

RT does a archive of old reviews for film and it's quite extensive. They also try to make adjustments for older films not having as many reviews.

I already fixed my post before you posted.
RT does not have an extensive library of old reviews. At least not to my standards or a municipal libraries.
Some reviews disappear after awhile. Also some of the reviews are 2 to 3 years well after the fact. The earliest TWINE review was post to RT 1-1-00. The film came out in Nov 1999.

Over 11 of the rotten reviews are after 2002. This is in no way indicative of the over all publics (or critics) view of TWINE at the time. Unless we are to believe that less than a 100 reviews of TWINE were written in 1999-00.

Well I won't nit pick at this, but I think the general feeling is that the negative reviews of QOS were that it was a letdown compared to CR, not that it was a letdown to TWINE.

I don't blame Brosnan for his films after GE. I think Brosnan was a great Bond who was handed horrible scripts and horrible directors, other than GE, which was brilliant.

[katied]

So true about the bad directors (I'm looking at YOU, Lee Tamahori! )

[Mazer Rackham]

Well I won't nit pick at this, but I think the general feeling is that the negative reviews of QOS were that it was a letdown compared to CR, not that it was a letdown to TWINE.

I don't blame Brosnan for his films after GE. I think Brosnan was a great Bond who was handed horrible scripts and horrible directors, other than GE, which was brilliant.

My only contention is the RT data. The recent entries are more reliable for comparison.

I know the point some try to make the Quark is let down from CR, my opinion is that is more or less the things complained about is what Craig's Bond is (obviously not talking about the stuttering camera angels) and it is more obvious post CR. Where as CR bought a lot of leeway because of it "reboot" concept and not being Bond yet pap. Somethings were accepted in CR what wouldn't have been in another movie and as it turns out are not acceptable in Quark.

But I have not voted in this poll yet becasue I have not seen Quark. Maybe this weekend maybe not.

[Mazer Rackham]

I hate the "Christmas only comes once a year" line.Tacky.

There are cringe worthy lines in almost all the movies including CR.

Nice avatar Katied.

[katied]

True about the bad lines in every movie. The "you know what I can do with my little finger" line in CR f'ristance.Makes me chuckle AND cringe at the same time(and yes,it's possible to do both! )

[FelixLeiterRocks]

Well I won't nit pick at this, but I think the general feeling is that the negative reviews of QOS were that it was a letdown compared to CR, not that it was a letdown to TWINE.

I don't blame Brosnan for his films after GE. I think Brosnan was a great Bond who was handed horrible scripts and horrible directors, other than GE, which was brilliant.

My only contention is the RT data. The recent entries are more reliable for comparison.

I know the point some try to make the Quark is let down from CR, my opinion is that is more or less the things complained about is what Craig's Bond is (obviously not talking about the stuttering camera angels) and it is more obvious post CR. Where as CR bought a lot of leeway because of it "reboot" concept and not being Bond yet pap. Somethings were accepted in CR what wouldn't have been in another movie and as it turns out are not acceptable in Quark.

But I have not voted in this poll yet becasue I have not seen Quark. Maybe this weekend maybe not.

Craig's Bond is not what is part of the problem with QOS. The problem more stems from a villian who was not nearly as intimidating or good as LeChiffe, and a lead girl who's not nearly as interesting or complex as Vesper Lynd.

James Bond is an assasin first and foremost. I think Craig's Bond is the closest since Connery to portray that part. To his credit Dalton did his best to bring out this as well, unfortunately some of the writers on his films were not on the same page, so we have Wayne Newton saying some rediculous things, in an otherwise solid Bond movie. TLDL was much better to what I consider a pure Bond film, and it's in my top 5 as well.

The thread was "is this the worst?" and the answer by any objective nature is no. When I think of worst Bond films I think of the majority of Moore and Brosnan's films. Moore best effort for me was probably TSWLM or FYEO. For Brosnan GE is the only one worthy of mentioning among the great Bond films, although working in the IT industry, I cringe when I hear the computer hacking stuff.

Dench's best work as M, has been in these last two films and in GE. I'm amazed she stuck around with the crap they wrote for her in the other Brosnan films.

[wrenchhands]

I think CR was a better film than QOS, but I don't think QOS is the worst bond ever.

If I may say so, I don't think it is fair to put DN through DAD on the same level as CR or QOS. It would be like comparing The Dark Knight to Shark Repellent Era Batman or the like.

I'm also not trying to start a flame war, just saying that a reboot is a reboot. There's been 40 years of "Bond meets villian, gets gadget from Q, defeats villian, gets girl". I am glad to see they are trying to start something new. I guess the early Bond films built up Spectre/Blofeld somewhat, but they didn't make the movies direct sequels as they have with CR/QOS. Plus, they had 3 different faces of Blofeld, didn't follow through on the most emotional peak of Tracy dying. And then Blofeld just sorta dissapeared from the scene.

So, what the new films are doing is cool because they are direct sequels and are forming a legit story arc. And they are doing it with more realism. It deals with international terrorists recouping funds, and the banal evil of economics in daily life and governance. I'm eager to see what they are doing with Quantum and with Mr White. I'm willing to bet Bond is gonna have to go rogue ala License to Kill as his vengeance butts up against international monied interests.

Look, I'm not just some dude who likes the new films. I've been a huge Bond fan ever since TBS ran the classics. I'm just saying it's time for something new. If the old Bonds were like individual episodes of CSI, than the new Bond is the Wire.

[katied]

Agreed with everything above.And to reiterate a point I've made elsewhere and here,numerous times,I don't understand the obsession some Bond fans have with bringing Blofeld back,or thinking that Quantum is going to be revealed to be SPECTRE. *yawn*. enough with that already.Sorry,but that dead horse is *very* tender